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Post by mac on Jul 14, 2018 12:57:34 GMT -5
He's a JumpStart/Knowledge Adventure employee and has been since the late '90s. The name "Fantom Studios" is just the brand name he uses for the stuff he makes independently. I suspect the booth sharing is done for the sake of simplicity. He probably hosts both of these at Comic-Con and having them in the same space is just easier.
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Post by Kaljinyu on Jul 15, 2018 0:23:07 GMT -5
So "technically" Neopets isn't at Comic-Con, Fantom Studios is? Neopets, JumpStart, NetDragon, they aren't actually registered, just someone who works there is registered, and they can just piggyback on someone else's presence?
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Post by Huntress on Jul 15, 2018 2:47:46 GMT -5
So "technically" Neopets isn't at Comic-Con, Fantom Studios is? Neopets, JumpStart, NetDragon, they aren't actually registered, just someone who works there is registered, and they can just piggyback on someone else's presence? I can only talk based on my experience with European corporate culture and have essentially no idea if there are any nuanced differences there with American corporate culture, but based on what I'm used to, this feels bog-standard. Like, I own a company. You can't actually associate me with it the way you can associate Williams with Fantom Studios because I'm not in the board due to legal wigglies, but it's the legal body I use to contract to my various publishing houses and translation companies so that they'll have someone to pay invoices to. My logic says that if you get a booth at Comic-Con, you need to attach a legal body to it so that there's someone to send invoices to, hold liable in case of complaints, and so that everyone knows who's responsible for tax reports. And if Williams was going to be there anyway as he is every year, it'd be much easier for everyone for Neopets (or Jumpstart, or Netdragon, doesn't really matter) to contract his company to share boothspace - which would essentially be paperwork between him and the legal body of Neopets so that everything stays kosher (and depending on how high up he is in Jumpstart and whether he's a stakeholder, it can easily mean that he signed this contract with himself). But de facto it means that Neopets shows up at Comic-Con and the technicalities of who pays whom for it and how much are handled behind the scenes. Depending on how much a booth costs, Netdragon might not even get fully involved and the expenses might just get reported somewhere in Other Operating Expenses in Neo's annual overhead for the parent company to smoosh into their consolidated reports without thinking too hard about it. Basically, what we're looking at is the world of small companies. The big ones conveniently come with big names attached in their paperwork, but waters can get pretty muddy in the small pools. And at present, Neopets is a small company (maybe always was, we just couldn't really tell as end-users, particularly when we were all kids who saw no reason to think about it very hard xP) so those would be the kind of cost-cutting optimization measures I'd expect from them. (not to mention, hey, mutual publicity - I know nothing about Williams and his independent work, but if I was to show up at that booth as a Neopets player, I'd be looking at his other work as well, and same goes to whatever non-Neopets-playing followers his name attracts to that booth. Again, I'd be questioning their business sense if they hadn't gone down this route.) |
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Post by Jae on Jul 15, 2018 19:17:37 GMT -5
"Technically" Neopets is not registered no, however I imagine Scrappy, Jade and whoever else from the California office who will be there have done everything properly in order to co-man Williams's booth. I agree with Huntress about the mutual publicity probably being the main thing here. I had personally never heard of Fantom Studios before all of this, and searching using Google either had it auto correct me to Fathom Studios, or it gave me top results of random Amazon stores and some Finnish page. I had to seriously dig to find Williams' personal website. Point is that anyone who is not familiar with Williams and his work would have a heck of a time finding out about it because of how poor his web presence is. As Huntress said, allowing Jumpstart and Neopets to hang out with him increases exposure to his side gig. (And people who go for him and decide to pick up Neo again for the nostalgia might end up bringing JS more money which enhances his job security). |
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Post by Kaljinyu on Jul 15, 2018 19:46:03 GMT -5
What I was wondering was, is Fantom Studios to JumpStart what, say... like, Infinite Interactive is to Neopets. Or Idol Minds is to Neopets. If Idol Minds or Infinite Interactive was gonna be at an E3 or a Comic-Con or something, and they were presenting a Neopets vidya gaem, then Neopets is at E3/Comic-Con through their association with the studio they work with to make the game.
But Fantom Studios, as an entity, it has no association with Neopets or JumpStart or NetDragon at all? I gotta wonder what the main attraction is. If it's Fantom Studios that's the actual host, and not Neopets. If Fantom Studios is primarily there to promote something else, and Neopets is like "But we're here too, and we have this game." Then again, I don't know how "formal" cons work, or that you could just squeak in as some other booth's "plus one."
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Post by Duke Pikachu on Jul 15, 2018 21:06:34 GMT -5
Well depending on how big the booth is they could split it. One side is promoting Fantom Studios while the other side is Neopets/JumpStart stuff. Neopets/JumpStart helps attract attention to the booth giving Williams exposure on his end. Of course that'll mean if you want to talk with Neopets/JumpStart you can't really at the booth as they need to keep people moving... which is why they're having the after party.
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Post by mac on Jul 15, 2018 21:51:48 GMT -5
Since this arrangement is practically identical to the one they had in 2014, you can check out the photos of the JS portion of the booth space to see what it was like: www.jellyneo.net/?go=comic_conMore food for thought: Fantom Studios goes every year regardless of JS being present, and a quick search shows this has been the case since at least 2007. Fantom Studios is always at booth #5566. |
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Post by Komori on Jul 15, 2018 22:37:16 GMT -5
Thought I'd add in my info here: You can't just decide to booth at San Diego Comic Con. There is a waitlist that is YEARS long, and if you give up your space, gotta go back on the waitlist. (My old professor from SCAD said they had to wait EIGHT years for SCAD to get a booth at SDCC) So if JS had a booth in 2014 and they gave it up since then, I imagine sharing the space with one of their employees would be the only way they'd have a convention presence.
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Post by Huntress on Jul 16, 2018 4:29:43 GMT -5
Yeah, I'm used to people booking spots at fairs some half a year in advance (small country, small fairs, I can easily imagine Comic-Con scaling that up a bunch) and the announcement of them having a booth at the con came way late - what, around a week before the actual con? Sounds like it was an incredibly last-minute decision or opportunity. It would've been sensible to announce this kind of stuff as soon as it was finalized, to give people time to make travel plans. So it may have been finalized more-or-less right now. But Fantom Studios, as an entity, it has no association with Neopets or JumpStart or NetDragon at all? I gotta wonder what the main attraction is. If it's Fantom Studios that's the actual host, and not Neopets. If Fantom Studios is primarily there to promote something else, and Neopets is like "But we're here too, and we have this game." Then again, I don't know how "formal" cons work, or that you could just squeak in as some other booth's "plus one." Well, define association? If the latter contracted the former to pay for shared boothspace so that they could both get exposure and possibly attract customers to the other as well then that is an association, it's just something that happens behind the scenes in the paperwork and has no bearing on what's shown to the general public. Companies interact based on what's mutually beneficial and those benefits can be short-term (for the duration of this con, in this case). They don't have to lock themselves into the same parent company for years to be, well, valid. If business was this rigid, people wouldn't stay in business. (I mean, of course it's possible that they didn't sign anything and Neopets is well and truly piggybacking off of Williams' generosity, but that is exactly how you end up in court afterwards when things don't go smoothly xD) |
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Post by Jae on Jul 16, 2018 6:56:11 GMT -5
I sincerely doubt it'd be kosher within Jumpstart for some employees to do another employee dirty like that. Honestly, based on what mac said it just seems to me like Williams has had his booth space secured for over a decade and he lets JS display there as well when they have something to display (in this year's case, Neopets's new mobile game + whatever else they want to hype up) so they don't have to go through the process of getting their own booth. We don't know how long it took to get this all set up; for all we know Neo going to SDCC was in the books forever before they finally decided 'o hey we should probably tell them.' At this point, that wouldn't surprise me one bit. |
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Post by Herdy on Jul 16, 2018 7:01:50 GMT -5
Yeah, if it's like what they did in 2014, Fantom Studios is just the name on the booking form. There won't be anything actually by just him at the booth. Given that School of Dragons is also hosting a Comic Con after party at the same venue as the Neopets one (a day later) it seems likely the School of Dragons team will also be at the Comic Con booth so it will be very similar to the 2014 setup.
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Post by mac on Jul 16, 2018 17:22:51 GMT -5
I didn't know School of Dragons was also hosting a party. If you go on their site, it isn't being advertised on the front page or news sections. You have to check the General Announcements section of the forum, which is viewable without an account: forum.schoolofdragons.com/content/vip-party-comic-con-tickets-saleTheir reaction is about what you'd expect. There are some adult players, but it isn't like Neopets where the game is old and the playerbase grew up. The game opened in 2013 and is intended for ages 8-12. Below is a link to the Eventbrite page. As Herdy said the venue is the same but the date is different. Tickets are still available: www.eventbrite.com/e/school-of-dragons-comic-con-vip-party-attendee-tickets-47694306956What's next? My money's on a Math Blasters 21+ party. Edit: A Youtuber by the name of Pet Simmer Julie posted a video about the event, and the Neopets account commented on it: It sounds like the focus of the party will be the app and those staff members who worked on it will be present. I wonder what they mean by "art corner"? |
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Post by Kaljinyu on Jul 17, 2018 5:57:48 GMT -5
Yeah, I'm used to people booking spots at fairs some half a year in advance (small country, small fairs, I can easily imagine Comic-Con scaling that up a bunch) and the announcement of them having a booth at the con came way late - what, around a week before the actual con? Sounds like it was an incredibly last-minute decision or opportunity. It would've been sensible to announce this kind of stuff as soon as it was finalized, to give people time to make travel plans. So it may have been finalized more-or-less right now. But Fantom Studios, as an entity, it has no association with Neopets or JumpStart or NetDragon at all? I gotta wonder what the main attraction is. If it's Fantom Studios that's the actual host, and not Neopets. If Fantom Studios is primarily there to promote something else, and Neopets is like "But we're here too, and we have this game." Then again, I don't know how "formal" cons work, or that you could just squeak in as some other booth's "plus one." Well, define association? If the latter contracted the former to pay for shared boothspace so that they could both get exposure and possibly attract customers to the other as well then that is an association, it's just something that happens behind the scenes in the paperwork and has no bearing on what's shown to the general public. Companies interact based on what's mutually beneficial and those benefits can be short-term (for the duration of this con, in this case). They don't have to lock themselves into the same parent company for years to be, well, valid. If business was this rigid, people wouldn't stay in business. (I mean, of course it's possible that they didn't sign anything and Neopets is well and truly piggybacking off of Williams' generosity, but that is exactly how you end up in court afterwards when things don't go smoothly xD) I mean "association" in that they're working together, like a third party video game studio and the publisher hand that feeds them. I thought that if Neopets was at Comic-Con, that meant they were there "officially," but San Diego Comic-Con doesn't actually work like that and there's no rule that says your booth can only host content or guests that are registered with you. Like, uh, Warner Bros. could set up a booth and, if the Comic-Con "ruling council" was the only one weighing in, they could air a screening of Infinity War. There's no rule that says you can't bring extra. |
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Post by mac on Jul 18, 2018 17:02:31 GMT -5
Something of interest I noticed today that doesn't warrant its own thread: JumpStart redesigned their website this month, and Neopets and School of Dragons have both been removed from the games and product pages. The only place they appear is in the list of links in the page footer. What's taken center stage is JumpStart Academy, the reason why NetDragon was interested in JumpStart to begin with. This project has been mentioned in a few different places, including David Lord's interview here where he describes it as their "first initiative": www.sramanamitra.com/2018/02/20/thought-leaders-in-online-gaming-jumpstart-games-ceo-david-lord-part-1/This probably has no relation to them going to Comic-Con, but it's possible. I guess we'll find out tomorrow (or maybe even tonight?) As for Neopets and School of Dragons being buried, who knows. Maybe they are waiting for the new Neopets mobile game to come out so they can push that instead. |
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Post by Komori on Jul 18, 2018 22:35:37 GMT -5
Like, uh, Warner Bros. could set up a booth and, if the Comic-Con "ruling council" was the only one weighing in, they could air a screening of Infinity War. There's no rule that says you can't bring extra. Well, they'd be in violation of a fairly big rule: copyright law. XD Disney owns the rights to Infinity War, which also includes the rights to public performances of said work. WB would have to license those rights first. Also, fairly sure Comic-Con probably has extensive rules about what can and can't be at a show floor booth. All this said, all this makes me really sad and nostalgic. Sad that TNT isn't at Neo anymore, that they're not doing a Comic Con. Sad that it's been quite a few years since I've been to Comic Con. (Which is too bad, because they're screening the first show I've ever animation-directed at a panel!) And then also nostalgic for the times back when I lugged my hefty laptop to the Neopets booth so I can show them my Flash animation and try to get an artist job. ;__; Gahhhh all the feels... |
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