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Post by Strife on May 28, 2009 13:50:38 GMT -5
PFA - Sorry about the slight grammatical err. xD; As for the Calin glitch... When you first enter a map after walking through a glowing arrow, does the game freeze up for more than a second? During the first second or so that a map is loaded, it removes all objects that aren't currently on the map, and I am led to believe that it's forgetting to delete the extra characters and objects when you play it. That could also be a cause for the extreme lag in Omni's case, since all of the objects in the entire dungeon could be kept running in the background even though they should be deleted since they're not on-screen. While you're playing, keep close attention to the edges of the map. If you see any monsters that suddenly enter the map on one of the edges, there I think that my theory is correct. I am afraid there's nothing that can be done about this until I can get my hands on a Mac and test it myself. I can assure you, however, that this definitely doesn't happen on a Windows PC. Ugh, I can't believe this. Three of my most dedicated testers and the game doesn't like any of their computers. Um, yeah, it does have a fairly lengthy pause when going from map to map via arrow. XD; I kinda figured that was just VPC's usual lag, but now that you mention it... Hmm, I don't know what to tell you. I don't suppose you could at least come up with some way to assure that the second Calin won't come walking through the wall? ^_^; You know, even if he exists, he won't be able to come over to where I am and glitch up mah game... *shrugs* It's very well possible, though I would have to to do it on an object-by-object basis for all of the important characters that can't have clones. Maybe if I place a "dummy object" outside the boundaries of the dungeon and run a condition to see if this dummy objects exists... and as long as it exists, delete everything outside the current map (including said dummy object). It could prove to be more stable than a timer event... although that still doesn't solve the issue of the other timer-based events I have in the game, which would cause such glitches as keys and treasure chest items being duplicated. One step at a time, though. ^_^
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Post by Omni on May 28, 2009 13:53:03 GMT -5
Oh, I forgot to mention: Yes, Ubuntu is a variation of Linux. Also, it looks like the shortcuts won't work with Wine… It's a different format than the Ubuntu shortcuts, I guess. So windowed mode won't work that way for me. I tried getting Wine to run the game in a virtual desktop window, but it still went full screen, for some reason.
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Post by PFA on May 28, 2009 13:56:49 GMT -5
Um, yeah, it does have a fairly lengthy pause when going from map to map via arrow. XD; I kinda figured that was just VPC's usual lag, but now that you mention it... Hmm, I don't know what to tell you. I don't suppose you could at least come up with some way to assure that the second Calin won't come walking through the wall? ^_^; You know, even if he exists, he won't be able to come over to where I am and glitch up mah game... *shrugs* It's very well possible, though I would have to to do it on an object-by-object basis for all of the important characters that can't have clones. Maybe if I place a "dummy object" outside the boundaries of the dungeon and run a condition to see if this dummy objects exists... and as long as it exists, delete everything outside the current map (including said dummy object). It could prove to be more stable than a timer event... although that still doesn't solve the issue of the other timer-based events I have in the game, which would cause such glitches as keys and treasure chest items being duplicated. One step at a time, though. ^_^ Ah, if it's timer-based, that could quite likely have something to do with it, what with the insane amounts of lag and all. XD; At any rate, hope you manage to come up with a working solution. :3
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Post by Strife on May 28, 2009 13:59:57 GMT -5
It's very well possible, though I would have to to do it on an object-by-object basis for all of the important characters that can't have clones. Maybe if I place a "dummy object" outside the boundaries of the dungeon and run a condition to see if this dummy objects exists... and as long as it exists, delete everything outside the current map (including said dummy object). It could prove to be more stable than a timer event... although that still doesn't solve the issue of the other timer-based events I have in the game, which would cause such glitches as keys and treasure chest items being duplicated. One step at a time, though. ^_^ Ah, if it's timer-based, that could quite likely have something to do with it, what with the insane amounts of lag and all. XD; At any rate, hope you manage to come up with a working solution. :3 Thank yous. ^^ This would be a heck of a lot easier if I had access to a Mac... because as it is, I just have to kindof guess how the outcome will turn out on a Mac and then upload the game after every change to see if it works. Can I come over to your house sometime? xD;
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Post by PFA on May 28, 2009 14:14:39 GMT -5
Ah, if it's timer-based, that could quite likely have something to do with it, what with the insane amounts of lag and all. XD; At any rate, hope you manage to come up with a working solution. :3 Thank yous. ^^ This would be a heck of a lot easier if I had access to a Mac... because as it is, I just have to kindof guess how the outcome will turn out on a Mac and then upload the game after every change to see if it works. Can I come over to your house sometime? xD; You're welcome. :3 Well to be precise, I'm doing it under Virtual PC, not just straight under Mac, but yeah, I know what you mean. XD; I don't suppose you have any used computer stores around there or anything? Lawl, I doubt I'd be able to properly explain someone from across the country coming over to discuss beta testing to my parents. XDDDD
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Post by KitClairvoyance on May 28, 2009 14:16:16 GMT -5
Um, yeah, it does have a fairly lengthy pause when going from map to map via arrow. XD; I kinda figured that was just VPC's usual lag, but now that you mention it... Hmm, I don't know what to tell you. I don't suppose you could at least come up with some way to assure that the second Calin won't come walking through the wall? ^_^; You know, even if he exists, he won't be able to come over to where I am and glitch up mah game... *shrugs* It's very well possible, though I would have to to do it on an object-by-object basis for all of the important characters that can't have clones. Maybe if I place a "dummy object" outside the boundaries of the dungeon and run a condition to see if this dummy objects exists... and as long as it exists, delete everything outside the current map (including said dummy object). It could prove to be more stable than a timer event... although that still doesn't solve the issue of the other timer-based events I have in the game, which would cause such glitches as keys and treasure chest items being duplicated. One step at a time, though. ^_^ Just throwing these possible solutions out there, since I'm not exactly sure what you're using, or what the bugs might be: 1. It seems like you might have a collision detection problem (gosh, I know how much of a pain these can be), with the issue of characters walking through walls, and being in places they're generally not meant to be. Assuming you're using bounding volumes to check if something's collided or not, using a bisection method to determine the exact point of collision might help: that way you get a definite "I've hit something," which is especially useful for fast objects, since they have the tendency to be completely on the other side when the checks are performed. Also, a quadtree is a really easy way of cutting down the number of checks you need to do, since it limits the objects to check against to a smaller area. 2. For the duplicate objects, a simple method I use a lot for levels is to create levels in "scenes", which really is just a fancy struct that contains lists of objects within that level. So when you unload a level, you just delete all the objects the lists within the corresponding scene. Since theoretically, you never add an object outside a list, that should ensure that you wouldn't miss a thing. It really makes object management a ton easier.
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Post by Omni on May 28, 2009 14:36:54 GMT -5
This would be a heck of a lot easier if I had access to a Mac... I actually have a couple Macs that we picked up and aren't planning on keeping. One thing though: We're planning on selling them. I know my dad keeps mentioning being able to sell one of them for $200. So I might be able to get you one, but you'd probably have to buy it. And for details and such, you'd have to talk to my dad about it, since he's the one selling. Oh yeah, I encountered the 'can't pick up apple' glitch again. This time, it wasn't on VMWare. I also saw what looked like some kinda shiny-star/yellow diamond at the edge of the screen. Maybe it has something to do with your extra objects theory?
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Post by Strife on May 28, 2009 15:46:51 GMT -5
It's very well possible, though I would have to to do it on an object-by-object basis for all of the important characters that can't have clones. Maybe if I place a "dummy object" outside the boundaries of the dungeon and run a condition to see if this dummy objects exists... and as long as it exists, delete everything outside the current map (including said dummy object). It could prove to be more stable than a timer event... although that still doesn't solve the issue of the other timer-based events I have in the game, which would cause such glitches as keys and treasure chest items being duplicated. One step at a time, though. ^_^ Just throwing these possible solutions out there, since I'm not exactly sure what you're using, or what the bugs might be: 1. It seems like you might have a collision detection problem (gosh, I know how much of a pain these can be), with the issue of characters walking through walls, and being in places they're generally not meant to be. Assuming you're using bounding volumes to check if something's collided or not, using a bisection method to determine the exact point of collision might help: that way you get a definite "I've hit something," which is especially useful for fast objects, since they have the tendency to be completely on the other side when the checks are performed. Also, a quadtree is a really easy way of cutting down the number of checks you need to do, since it limits the objects to check against to a smaller area. 2. For the duplicate objects, a simple method I use a lot for levels is to create levels in "scenes", which really is just a fancy struct that contains lists of objects within that level. So when you unload a level, you just delete all the objects the lists within the corresponding scene. Since theoretically, you never add an object outside a list, that should ensure that you wouldn't miss a thing. It really makes object management a ton easier. The thing about FQ (and JP, for that matter) is that I built it within a user interface that handles all of the code underneath the curtains. During the development of both games, I never typed a single line of hard code since the program i'm using does it automatically based on a sequence of conditions and actions that I create. This also applies to the method of movement that I gave to characters and monsters - a large portion of the movement is handled automatically by the program. Because of this lack of control over the hard code, I have to write the instructions to the program so that they "work around" any bugs or glitches that I encounter. Multimedia Fusion 2 (the latest version of the program i'm using) gives developers more control by allowing them to open and edit the hard code underneath the surface. I really want to get it and import both of my games... but unfortunately the new version won't recognize some of the add-ons that i've applied to the games (such as the custom text and the sound system in FQ), so I kinda have to sit and wait for the original makers of those add-ons to develop MMF2 compatibility. Until then, i'm stuck with version 1.5. To be honest, I think the only permanent solution to some of the bugs i'm faced with is to either 1) Use C++ to program custom add-ons for MMF 1.5 that will specifically handle the gameplay in FQ, then rebuild the entire code structure to fit these add-ons, or 2) Build the entire game from scratch in a new program. I think 1 is the better choice, though it would push back development considerably. xD;
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Post by Shadaras on May 28, 2009 16:25:19 GMT -5
Just so you know, the twin-Calin glitch didn't appear when I played it. In fact, the only glitch I've encountered so far (I'm currently just past that zipline you have a screenshot of, I think) was in the tunnels when I encountered a botan stuck in the wall. The one in the room with a treasure chest with a herb in it, if that helps. And yeah. I use Windows, by the way.
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Post by Strife on May 28, 2009 16:33:00 GMT -5
Just so you know, the twin-Calin glitch didn't appear when I played it. In fact, the only glitch I've encountered so far (I'm currently just past that zipline you have a screenshot of, I think) was in the tunnels when I encountered a botan stuck in the wall. The one in the room with a treasure chest with a herb in it, if that helps. And yeah. I use Windows, by the way. I've been talking to Goosh on MSN while he played through the game, and it's the same case with him - no twin-Calin glitch. So I believe that's reason enough to believe that the game works like it should on Windows XP. ^^ When the botan was stuck in the wall, did it ever teleport at any point in time? I added a script that teleports monsters away from a wall if they get stuck in it.
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Post by Shadaras on May 28, 2009 16:36:04 GMT -5
Just so you know, the twin-Calin glitch didn't appear when I played it. In fact, the only glitch I've encountered so far (I'm currently just past that zipline you have a screenshot of, I think) was in the tunnels when I encountered a botan stuck in the wall. The one in the room with a treasure chest with a herb in it, if that helps. And yeah. I use Windows, by the way. I've been talking to Goosh on MSN while he played through the game, and it's the same case with him - no twin-Calin glitch. So I believe that's reason enough to believe that the game works like it should on Windows XP. ^^ When the botan was stuck in the wall, did it ever teleport at any point in time? I added a script that teleports monsters away from a wall if they get stuck in it. It came out when I attacked it. Which was not long after I spotted it. So yes, your script worked.
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Post by Omni on May 28, 2009 18:23:57 GMT -5
I've been talking to Goosh on MSN while he played through the game, and it's the same case with him - no twin-Calin glitch. So I believe that's reason enough to believe that the game works like it should on Windows XP. ^^ OBJECTION! The thing is, under VirtalPC or VMWare, we are running the game under an authentic, legal copy of WindowsXP (I had to activate it and everything). (In case you're wondering why it looks different than usual, I have several options set differently or off to try and get it to run faster.) Many emulators that emulate computers use the actual OS installation disc. To me, it seems more likely to have something to do with the way it's emulated, or the speed thereof. VPC for Mac has to actually emulate a whole different processor. VMWare, so far as I know, only runs on Intel machines, is actually rather fast, and is so similar to the actual thing that it can play Maple Story without a complaint from GameGuard or HackShield. Yet they both had this glitch. …Come to think of it, if you have an unused computer, extra hard drive, or maybe just enough extra disc space, you could install Ubuntu, or another version of Linux on it, install Virtual Box on it, and install XP on that to test for this stuff. Similarly, you could use VMWare Converter to make a copy of your physical machine and run it under VMWare Player or Virtual Box. (The latter method is also handy if you lost the install disc or something.) Either way it would be free, and it should behave the same way, so you could test for these things. And you could even install Wine and see if you could get it running more quickly there. On another note, I just updated WindowsXP to see if it makes a difference with the twin-Calin glitch. *goes to test* EDIT: Nothing yet.
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Post by Amneiger on May 28, 2009 19:42:53 GMT -5
I clicked on the download link and it said something about the file being invalid. It doesn't look like anybody else is having this problem, which is odd.
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Post by Strife on May 28, 2009 19:56:52 GMT -5
I clicked on the download link and it said something about the file being invalid. It doesn't look like anybody else is having this problem, which is odd. Aaha, it appears that Mediafire scrambled my download link when I updated the game's readme file and uploaded it again. This link should work: www.mediafire.com/?0v422i2ltn5Omni - Hmm... your objection makes sense. x3 Assuming this is true, then your testimony would be further evidence towards the idea of lag causing the game to glitch up. I could possibly create a start-of-level event in which the game's "timer" is reset the moment the map is loaded. Failing that, i'll need to swing over to an MMF support forum and see if there's another way around it.
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Post by Amneiger on May 29, 2009 3:00:47 GMT -5
That works better xD I just spent the last few hours playing it. If you stand a certain distance to the left of a Flesh-Eater (if I'm remembering the name of the big purple biting flowers correctly), you can swing your sword and have every second strike or so hit the Flesh-Eater without retaliation.
I had to guess the code for the Forbidden Grotto. Is the code hidden somewhere, or is this the way I was supposed to do it?
In the room where you fight Blin, opening the menu and closing it causes the barrels with money to respawn, complete with more money inside of them. So somebody very patient could make an infinite amount of money this way.
The scroll listing the various courses offered by the gym have their prices listed in gold, not ore.
Also the gym: if you speak the teacher (I've forgotten his name) after completing the Forbidden Grotto and press spacebar when he asks you if you are here for training, the game seems to act as if you've said no instead of actually giving you a chance to say yes or no.
In the inn, if I rent a room, go upstairs, select a bed, and say that I don't want to rest in that bed, both beds become inoperable. The only thing I can do is go back downstairs, leave the inn (since the innkeeper won't let me have another room until I do so), and come back and rent the room again.
The barn in map square F5 opens its door as if there was a room inside, but pressing Enter doesn't do anything.
The arrows leading from E1 to E2 and back are invisible; you can only notice them when you step on them, which causes them to show the sparkles and play the arrow sound.
The arrow leading from E2 to E1 is directly in front of the cave. Whenever I go to stand in front of the entrance of the cave, I find myself standing on the arrow leading to E1. So I can't enter the cave, since whenever I press Enter to enter a new area the game sends me to E1 instead of into the cave.
This is almost certainly specific to my computer, but when the game closes it doesn't reset the monitor resolution.
I've looked in the cave in E1 and found nothing but a dead end two screens in; that's where I am right now. I haven't found any other exits out of the Dyre Woods.
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