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Post by irishdragonlord on Sept 30, 2004 20:53:40 GMT -5
"Barbie is a Lesbian"
"I Love Lesbians"
"Homosexuality is Shameful"
"I Broke a Rule I Prayed in School I'm a Menace to Society"
Get the point?
I just recently read in Newsweek about some kids who were suspended for wearing shirts - one girls for the aforementioned lesbian shirts after being told all lesbians are going to hell, the homosexuality one on some "Day of Silence" I have never heard of, dedicated to respecting gays and transsexuals. There are also Bush-hater, "Dont mock my God and kill my Generation", etc. etc. that have gotten kids in trouble for wearing them. Some cases won, some lost.
So, what do you say? Should the shirts - ALL the shirts - be allowed, some, or none?
I say none. Don't force your views about gays and transsexuals being ok, I won't throw it in your face. Don't tell me the guy I'd vote for is a terrorist, I won't blame you for a nutjob. Etc.
Your call?
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Post by TheEaterofWorlds on Oct 1, 2004 0:47:14 GMT -5
In school- yes. The school as an institution has the right to make and enforce a dress code. Same with a place of employment. In general/public? Wear whatever you want.
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Post by Kiddo on Oct 1, 2004 1:04:00 GMT -5
Funny that'd you mention this. Just yesterday some guy came into my creative writing class wearing a shirt that proclaimed "Abortion is homicide." I thought he had a heckuva lotta guts, especially considering the crowd he was walking into.
My thoughts are - if you are comfortable enough projecting your views like that and are prepared for the consequences - then go for it. If you think you can defend your position and are ready for any hasseling it may bring about then you can wear it and I won't care. We can't go around sugar-coating everything after all.
Granted, I am in college and they don't sugarcoat anything up here. High school tries to do that for you it seems. In that case I'd say its up to the discretion of the principal, which is usually how loud the parents whine...
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Post by sollunaestrella on Oct 1, 2004 17:13:37 GMT -5
Eh. If a high school supports the Day of Silence and encourages their students to participate (and mine did and if you didn't participate you were considered stupid and "narrow-minded" :  , then they can't tell kids not to wear a "Homosexuality is Shameful" shirt. That wouldn't be fair. Of course, there's a limit - certainly the shirt can't be obscene or any sort of message of hate or anything totally disrespectful. But if students can express their views about homosexuality through a Day of Silence, then why can't another student express their views through their clothing? A school has no right to support a Day of Silence for something if they silence those against it. But - as with all things - there is a limit. I don't see why students can't wear political T-shirts or religious T-shirts if they want to as long as the message is respectful. (Eh, personally, I would LOVE to get that last T-shirt you mentioned and wear it to school.) But if the shirt is a blatant attack rather than just a quiet reflection of a person's views, then something should be done. |
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Post by Crystal on Oct 1, 2004 22:34:00 GMT -5
"Barbie is a Lesbian" "I Love Lesbians" "Homosexuality is Shameful" "I Broke a Rule I Prayed in School I'm a Menace to Society" Get the point? XDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD I want that last shirt. I really really do. |
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Post by irishdragonlord on Oct 2, 2004 6:34:10 GMT -5
XDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD I want that last shirt. I really really do. My friend has that one, along with such gems as: "Friends don't let friends go to hell". I MUST learn where he's buying these. I like the Menace to Society one too. 0:) |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2004 7:00:07 GMT -5
There are some that should be able to be worn to school: "Someone should poke you in the eye with a really hot french fry!" "My kingdom for a slurpee." "I just want to let you know once you leave I will make fun of you." "Hey you make me throw up a little." Those shirts, and others that are slightly offensive to the whole Human Race, should be allowed.
Now the lesbian and gay shirts...why do they even exsist? I've got very strong beliefs with Lesbian and gays and stuff. Those kids who wore those shirts got what they deserved.
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Post by Rishiy on Oct 2, 2004 10:57:07 GMT -5
If you're school says don't wear them, don't. If you do you're wearing it to make a scene, not a point anyway.
But outside of school, whatever. Most of those shirts are just Hot Topic or other such stores preying on pseudo intelectual pre-teens.
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Post by TheEaterofWorlds on Oct 3, 2004 0:31:53 GMT -5
Now the lesbian and gay shirts...why do they even exsist? I've got very strong beliefs with Lesbian and gays and stuff. Those kids who wore those shirts got what they deserved. Oh yes, it's much easier if people with different opinions and lifestyles don't express themselves because they offend you.  They exist because some people are proud of who they are, and want the world to know and except them for who they are. Why do religous shirts even exist? For the same reason. Some people don't agree with Homosexuality and some people don't agree with Christianity, that doesn't mean either should stop existing or that people from both groups don't have a right to wear what they want. If the Christian kids get in trouble, would you say they got what they deserved? No, because you agree with them. Free Speech isn't just for the people with veiws you support, it's for everyone. As far as I'm concerned, either they ALL deserved it or they all DIDN'T. There's no middle ground with this. As for the day of silence, people who choose to participate in this do not speak and hand out cards that read; "Please understand my reasons for not speaking today. I support lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender rights. People who are silent today believe that laws and attitudes should be inclusive of people of all sexual orientations. The Day of Silence is to draw attention to those who have been silenced by hatred, oppression, and prejudice. Think about the voices you are not hearing. What can you do to end the silence?" I am heterosexual, but I support gay rights. I support and applaud this effort. However, if people who don't agree are being forced to observe this (Which is meant to be voluntary) I think that's wrong and defeats the purpose. |
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Post by irishdragonlord on Oct 3, 2004 7:33:32 GMT -5
Oh yes, it's much easier if people with different opinions and lifestyles don't express themselves because they offend you. They exist because some people are proud of who they are, and want the world to know and except them for who they are. Why do religous shirts even exist? For the same reason. Some people don't agree with Homosexuality and some people don't agree with Christianity, that doesn't mean either should stop existing or that people from both groups don't have a right to wear what they want. If the Christian kids get in trouble, would you say they got what they deserved? No, because you agree with them. Free Speech isn't just for the people with veiws you support, it's for everyone. As far as I'm concerned, either they ALL deserved it or they all DIDN'T. There's no middle ground with this. As for the day of silence, people who choose to participate in this do not speak and hand out cards that read; "Please understand my reasons for not speaking today. I support lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender rights. People who are silent today believe that laws and attitudes should be inclusive of people of all sexual orientations. The Day of Silence is to draw attention to those who have been silenced by hatred, oppression, and prejudice. Think about the voices you are not hearing. What can you do to end the silence?" I am heterosexual, but I support gay rights. I support and applaud this effort. However, if people who don't agree are being forced to observe this (Which is meant to be voluntary) I think that's wrong and defeats the purpose. Thank you for saying what I would have liked to, in a much longer, better-sounding way ;D |
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Post by TheEaterofWorlds on Oct 3, 2004 12:22:54 GMT -5
Thank you for saying what I would have liked to, in a much longer, better-sounding way ;D ^^;; Heh, longer is right. I have a hard time keeping things short, obviously. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2004 13:17:58 GMT -5
Oh yes, it's much easier if people with different opinions and lifestyles don't express themselves because they offend you. Thought about the other people they offend?? The lesbian and gays themselves, prehaps? And there are other people that would agree with me. A LOT[/u] of people. |
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Post by TheEaterofWorlds on Oct 3, 2004 14:28:35 GMT -5
Thought about the other people they offend?? The lesbian and gays themselves, prehaps? And there are other people that would agree with me. A LOT[/u] of people.[/quote] Yes, I'm sure there are a lot of people who agree with you. Some of the other shirts offend me, but people still have a right to wear them. Just because some people don't like the shirts doesn't mean they shouldn't even exist. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2004 14:44:10 GMT -5
I do not think shirts should be allowed in school if they are offensive, like the following possible example:
"You are stupid if you do/don't believe in (insert belief)."
However, I do think they should allow shirts that say something like this:
"I do/don't believe in (insert belief)."
With the second example, you're not insulting anyone for their belief/disbelief.
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Post by Patjade on Oct 3, 2004 15:01:12 GMT -5
I do not think shirts should be allowed in school if they are offensive, like the following possible example: "You are stupid if you do/don't believe in (insert belief)." However, I do think they should allow shirts that say something like this: "I do/don't believe in (insert belief)." With the second example, you're not insulting anyone for their belief/disbelief. Then the only REAL solution would be to ban shirts that have ANYTHING written or printed on them. No sayings. No logos. No designs. No tags. Nothing. A plain white shirt, pocket optional. Same for pants. Plain black slacks. For shoes, perhaps black Oxfords or Mary Janes. Period. That way, there is nothing to offend anyone. No "Colors", no brands, no phrases. No associations. Is this what you want in school? After all, it is an institute for education, not a public forum your agenda. I don't think many people would agree with this, though. |
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, then they can't tell kids not to wear a "Homosexuality is Shameful" shirt. That wouldn't be fair. Of course, there's a limit - certainly the shirt can't be obscene or any sort of message of hate or anything totally disrespectful. But if students can express their views about homosexuality through a Day of Silence, then why can't another student express their views through their clothing? A school has no right to support a Day of Silence for something if they silence those against it.
