Fox hunting

[neonick]

OK, so I thought people might like to discuss this. Today a vote was taken to ban fox hunting in the UK. The vote happened after a delay, caused by protesters burst in and yelled at the MPs. It was decided to ban all fox hunting in the country, and will be enforced within the next two years. 10000-20000 protesters outside heard it all angrily, saying that it "isn't cruel" and is a good way to manage the countryside.
I myself am very anti-hunting. I think it's awful to attack foxes with a bunch of hounds, and am very glad a ban has been put in place.

[Tdyans at work]

I honestly don't know much about it, but about the part about managing the countryside.... Does that mean that the foxes they're hunting are wild? I guess the portrayals I've seen always give the idea that they're captive animals who are kept and then released specifically for the purpose of being hunted. I'm just curious to understand more about the whole thing.

[william]

Guest-Tdyans said:

I honestly don't know much about it, but about the part about managing the countryside.... Does that mean that the foxes they're hunting are wild? I guess the portrayals I've seen always give the idea that they're captive animals who are kept and then released specifically for the purpose of being hunted. I'm just curious to understand more about the whole thing.

No, they are wild. They're hunted by country people because they kill their chickens for fun. We're actually doing stuff about this in English lessons, and we'll watch videos about it. The teacher said that first he was antihunting, but now is kind of... not sure. A point that was brought up was that the people deciding on the ban are city folk and don't understand the country way of life. A ban means that people will loose their jobs, and the thousands of hunting hounds will be put to sleep. Although, I think that it is a cruel way of killing foxes, and shooting them or injecting them would be far more humane. Very few hunts actually kill a fox, but when they do, it gets ripped apart by the hounds. If that doesn't happen, then it will most likely die from the stress of it.

[Torey]

Guest-Tdyans said:

I honestly don't know much about it, but about the part about managing the countryside.... Does that mean that the foxes they're hunting are wild? I guess the portrayals I've seen always give the idea that they're captive animals who are kept and then released specifically for the purpose of being hunted. I'm just curious to understand more about the whole thing.

Yes, the foxes are wild. In a way, it is their country and they are being hunted just for sport. Things like mink get hunted too but they aren't native to the UK. I think we want to rid UK of the minks because they're destorying countryside. I still don't like how they're hunting them though because to me, all hunting is bad. However, I think fox hunting makes me so much more angry. It's the fact that the fox hunters gallop around in fancy dress on horses and use their slaves (hounds) to kill the foxes in a barbaric way. I'm glad that it's getting banned because it is so cruel.

[william]

Ginger said:

Yes, the foxes are wild. In a way, it is their country and they are being hunted just for sport. Things like mink get hunted too but they aren't native to the UK. I think we want to rid UK of the minks because they're destorying countryside. I still don't like how they're hunting them though because to me, all hunting is bad. However, I think fox hunting makes me so much more angry. It's the fact that the fox hunters gallop around in fancy dress on horses and use their slaves (hounds) to kill the foxes in a barbaric way. I'm glad that it's getting banned because it is so cruel.

Yes, I agree that it needn't be such a show, but the foxes are damaging the farmers livelihood (sp?). After all, they kill the chickens, but they don't eat them, they just do it for sport. Another interesting point raised was:

Would you feel the same way if they were hunting rats?

[neonick]

Ginger said:

Yes, the foxes are wild. In a way, it is their country and they are being hunted just for sport. Things like mink get hunted too but they aren't native to the UK. I think we want to rid UK of the minks because they're destorying countryside. I still don't like how they're hunting them though because to me, all hunting is bad. However, I think fox hunting makes me so much more angry. It's the fact that the fox hunters gallop around in fancy dress on horses and use their slaves (hounds) to kill the foxes in a barbaric way. I'm glad that it's getting banned because it is so cruel.

I agree. It is very cruel and barbaric. I don't care if a few people prancing about in posh suits don't get to kill animals any more, but I hope the hounds aren't put down, because it's not their fault- it's what they've been trained to do.
I'd say that while it IS city people creating this ban, I think no matter where you're from you should see that this sort of thing is inhuman and disgusting.

[Tdyans at work]

Will said:

No, they are wild. They're hunted by country people because they kill their chickens for fun.

Not for food? Again, this is probably another misconception brought about by how it's represented in various media, but I was under the impression that it was less a matter of utility and more a matter of sport. It's always portrayed as a bunch of rich people who do it just for fun, not as farmers who are doing it to protect their livestock.

But this doesn't prohibit them from killing the foxes in different, and possibly more humane, ways, does it?

[neonick]

Will said:

Would you feel the same way if they were hunting rats?

Ooh, good point. Although foxes don't spread disease and illness in the towns, like rats do. And there are far less.

Guest-Tdyans said:

But this doesn't prohibit them from killing the foxes in different, and possibly more humane, ways, does it?

Ooh, another good point.

[william]

Also, the bill can be overturned by the House of Lords, although they MAY only be able to put it off for six months...

[neonick]

Will said:

Also, the bill can be overturned by the House of Lords, although they MAY only be able to put it off for six months...

I thought the MPs were using their special powers to make this law, regardless of the Lords? Who, by the way, are the posh sort of people I really don't think should be making this decision.

[william]

Neonick said:

I thought the MPs were using their special powers to make this law, regardless of the Lords? Who, by the way, are the posh sort of people I really don't think should be making this decision.

The Lords are more traditional than the MPs, so they may veto the bill.

[william]

I'm going to bring up another point that was made in English.


Are foxes really more important than peoples' jobs, and their ability to support their families?


And by saving the few foxes actually killed by hunts each year, you are killing thousands of dogs.

[neonick]

Will said:

I'm going to bring up another point that was made in English.


Are foxes really more important than peoples' jobs, and their ability to support their families?


And by saving the few foxes actually killed by hunts each year, you are killing thousands of dogs.

I would say that there are many other jobs they could take, they don't have to be killing foxes. And I would also suspect that very few of the dogs will be put down, but be put up for adoption. I really hope they don't put the dogs down, but I'm still against fox hunting.

[william]

Neonick said:

I would say that there are many other jobs they could take, they don't have to be killing foxes. And I would also suspect that very few of the dogs will be put down, but be put up for adoption. I really hope they don't put the dogs down, but I'm still against fox hunting.

Hounds aren't like dogs. They aren't pets. They can't be adopted, all they can do is hunt foxes.

And by lost jobs, I wasn't refering to hunters, for them it's just a sport, but to the blacksmiths, who put the shoes on the horses. Yes, not all horses are on the hunt, but an example given was that a if a smith shoed 100 horses, 90 might be on the hunt, and 10 might not. If you're only shoeing 10, then you won't be paid enough, and it won't be worth your while.

[aakfish]

Fox Hunters who say they do it because they are pests and need to be killed are talking out of a place I never wan't to go. There are ways that would be less painful to the fox if they needed to kill it. They do it for entertainment and that is wrong, animals shouldn't die for entertainment. If they need to get rid of foxs to control the countryside why dont they find a way that isnt fun for them.