Post by Ginz ❤ on Jun 22, 2010 16:55:37 GMT -5
Hi, IC Chat Threaders.
So there was a collection of posts that came to the attention of the staff. We're writing this post to you guys to address some specific concerns that were mentioned last night. (We also recommend you go read the announcement that was just put up, too.)
The first thing that was evident in the what was read in the posts was that some of you guys still harbor a grudge about this separate thread. Let us address a few points on that first and foremost. We'll move onto the others from there.
1. The Separate Thread Debate
There is some line of thought that if there had been mods involved in the OC chatting and involved on the other side, that things would've turned out a lot different. That's really not so. Actually, there really are mods that have alternate personae. They just don't use them to the great deal and abundance that you guys do. Even if there had been a mod that was heavily involved in it, the outcome would not have changed. This isn't a matter of being right for the virtue of being mods. So let us retread the reasoning that led to spinning off the thread.
The first reasoning is that it got to be too much for the 'bloids. It's two different points of reference; where you all saw fun times and it should all have been like normal, to other people (not just the mods, by the way), it had the same effect as a continuous use of puppets or marionettes or ventriloquist dummies (essentially something that gives a voice to a fictional character in real life). We don't say that to demean or belittle the concept, but it was essentially the same as that kind of situation in terms as to what others saw, and it's a good parallel to this situation when you examine it. And that kind of thing just doesn't appeal to everyone. Unfortunately, it's not like a topical matter where topics can come and go and change throughout time. It drove people away as they became disinterested in chatting there, with that kind of thing going on. Even trying to break into the group was not easy to do. The chatters involved in it became almost exclusively IC roleplays (keep in mind roleplay here is just the only way to describe it), and without a significant group of non-RPers there, it was nigh impossible to carry on a normal conversation or different line of posting. That ended up driving people away. It was changing the very atmosphere of the 'bloids. So instead of squashing your fun altogether, we asked it be taken to a separate thread. Which shouldn't be a problem for you guys. A thread is nothing except where posts collect. The forum is altogether more than just one thread and it's not even like you were being asked to move to a different room or table. Just collect the posts elsewhere in a thread made for that.
This isn't the first time this has happened, either. A couple years ago, there was a phase where discussions of Phoenix Wright got really overdone. What happened then? The fanclub thread was set up to collect those posts for that purpose. Around the same time, Kit and Shade were asked to tone down their rather "exclusive" KitShade chats on the 'bloids. Rather longer back, original characters came in the shape of children of 'bloid couples. A separate thread had been spun off for them at that time when it got to be too much, too. When something gets to be too much for the 'bloids, it gets spun off into it's own thread. It happens often and it's not evil or exile.
To expand on something we just said prior, too, the forum is greater than one thread. The forum is NOT just the 'bloids. The splitting off doesn't mean that we're not your friends anymore, or somehow anti-OC chatting on the forum. The point you need to remember is that you have a thread for it now. Just like the 'bloids. It's on equal footing with the 'bloids. The 'bloids entered into forum culture because they became the social chatting nexus. But that thread is not the center of the forum, nor is it the only chat-kind of thread around. There are plenty of people that find enjoyment around here and make friends with people while never stepping foot in the 'bloids. Just because people choose to hangout on different threads doesn't mean the forum is less a community, or less accepting, or less together. We're keeping multiple people happy by having multiple threads dedicated to different things, instead of just one thread that only one group is ever happy with at a time.
Let's look at this from a different perspective. The new IC-chat thing? That's now a part of forum culture. Think about it... you guys have added something entirely new to the forum, to the point that it got to be too big and too much for the 'bloids and spun off onto it's own. You guys are creating forum history here and now with this thread. You guys are providing something for people that may not enjoy the general chat of the 'bloids but love exactly what you're doing. And as well, if what you're doing hasn't changed at all, why should it matter to you that it doesn't take place in the same location as others? You're doing what you enjoy with the people you enjoyed doing it with either way, so what's the big problem there? You guys should be PROUD to have a new ongoing thread like this, to laud the fact your OCs have entered into forum culture in such a way. Maybe not everyone enjoys it like you, but so what? The forum is providing you guys with a way to express yourselves in that way and show your love for this. You can't lose.
A separate thread doesn't make you less than any one else or any other thread in the forum. Each for its own use for a purpose and reason, after all. This is just keeping with that concept--otherwise we might as well have the entirety of the forum in one single thread.
2. The Use of ICs in the 'Bloids
Some of you still seem to think you and your alternate personae have been entirely exiled from the 'bloids. That's not true. They can still come in with limited use, even have some limited dialogue with other posters. But it should be side related things that don't spin off into their own whole conversation. Having an OC pop up in a post will not get you yelled at, nor banned, nor nothing of the sort. If it gets to be too much, all that will be said (at most) is a request you move it to IC if it's going to be continued on. No trouble, no warnings, no bannings, nothing. And if someone DOES get snippy with you, just talk with a mod about it.
So to put this plainly: there isn't some line that you have to be afraid of crossing or stepping over. Stepping over "the line" may get you asked to move it over, but that'll be it. You're not going to get in trouble. And we can't give you a better description of where not to go, because it's another situation where there's no quantifiable description (x number posts, no more than so many words, etc). We're not that harsh, guys, that you have to be afraid of anything like that. There is no line. There's just a range of IC activity on the 'bloids that extends from none to too much. The closer you get to the "too much" side of the range, the more likely you'll be asked to move over to another thread. And that point may come at different times depending on who's there, and so forth. Just... don't overthink and worry about it.
Again, not to completely demean the OCs and IC-chatting, but if you really want something to base that on in interacting with the 'bloids, think about going to a room or social lounge with a bunch of friends. Treat the OCs in that context like you might treat bringing in a puppet or marionette or whatever you want to choose as a real-life version of the same concept. Think about how often you would bring them up or use them in a real life context like that, how much it might take before it started to get old for others and cross into "too much" territory. That might help you decide on where to draw the line a bit, if you're really wanting to have something to go off of.
3. The Lack of Mods Chatting Doesn't Mean They Don't See It
Mods read more things than you might think. Just because they aren't there chatting doesn't mean they don't see things that come up. True, it might be harder to keep up with a chat board that you don't participate in, and some things may fall through the cracks. If a problem comes up, just talk with a mod about it. That's always been the case for the bloids, too.
So between this and the points being made in the other post/announcement, we think everything is covered. Please consider these words and come to a point where you can move past any grudges or anger you may harbor about what happened. In the end, there were no hard feelings on our part towards you all, we were just trying to do our job on behalf of the forum and not what a small group of people wanted. It's rather saddening and disheartening to see that this still appears to be a problem for some people.
Thank you guys, and have a great day/night.
--NTWF Staff
So there was a collection of posts that came to the attention of the staff. We're writing this post to you guys to address some specific concerns that were mentioned last night. (We also recommend you go read the announcement that was just put up, too.)
The first thing that was evident in the what was read in the posts was that some of you guys still harbor a grudge about this separate thread. Let us address a few points on that first and foremost. We'll move onto the others from there.
1. The Separate Thread Debate
There is some line of thought that if there had been mods involved in the OC chatting and involved on the other side, that things would've turned out a lot different. That's really not so. Actually, there really are mods that have alternate personae. They just don't use them to the great deal and abundance that you guys do. Even if there had been a mod that was heavily involved in it, the outcome would not have changed. This isn't a matter of being right for the virtue of being mods. So let us retread the reasoning that led to spinning off the thread.
The first reasoning is that it got to be too much for the 'bloids. It's two different points of reference; where you all saw fun times and it should all have been like normal, to other people (not just the mods, by the way), it had the same effect as a continuous use of puppets or marionettes or ventriloquist dummies (essentially something that gives a voice to a fictional character in real life). We don't say that to demean or belittle the concept, but it was essentially the same as that kind of situation in terms as to what others saw, and it's a good parallel to this situation when you examine it. And that kind of thing just doesn't appeal to everyone. Unfortunately, it's not like a topical matter where topics can come and go and change throughout time. It drove people away as they became disinterested in chatting there, with that kind of thing going on. Even trying to break into the group was not easy to do. The chatters involved in it became almost exclusively IC roleplays (keep in mind roleplay here is just the only way to describe it), and without a significant group of non-RPers there, it was nigh impossible to carry on a normal conversation or different line of posting. That ended up driving people away. It was changing the very atmosphere of the 'bloids. So instead of squashing your fun altogether, we asked it be taken to a separate thread. Which shouldn't be a problem for you guys. A thread is nothing except where posts collect. The forum is altogether more than just one thread and it's not even like you were being asked to move to a different room or table. Just collect the posts elsewhere in a thread made for that.
This isn't the first time this has happened, either. A couple years ago, there was a phase where discussions of Phoenix Wright got really overdone. What happened then? The fanclub thread was set up to collect those posts for that purpose. Around the same time, Kit and Shade were asked to tone down their rather "exclusive" KitShade chats on the 'bloids. Rather longer back, original characters came in the shape of children of 'bloid couples. A separate thread had been spun off for them at that time when it got to be too much, too. When something gets to be too much for the 'bloids, it gets spun off into it's own thread. It happens often and it's not evil or exile.
To expand on something we just said prior, too, the forum is greater than one thread. The forum is NOT just the 'bloids. The splitting off doesn't mean that we're not your friends anymore, or somehow anti-OC chatting on the forum. The point you need to remember is that you have a thread for it now. Just like the 'bloids. It's on equal footing with the 'bloids. The 'bloids entered into forum culture because they became the social chatting nexus. But that thread is not the center of the forum, nor is it the only chat-kind of thread around. There are plenty of people that find enjoyment around here and make friends with people while never stepping foot in the 'bloids. Just because people choose to hangout on different threads doesn't mean the forum is less a community, or less accepting, or less together. We're keeping multiple people happy by having multiple threads dedicated to different things, instead of just one thread that only one group is ever happy with at a time.
Let's look at this from a different perspective. The new IC-chat thing? That's now a part of forum culture. Think about it... you guys have added something entirely new to the forum, to the point that it got to be too big and too much for the 'bloids and spun off onto it's own. You guys are creating forum history here and now with this thread. You guys are providing something for people that may not enjoy the general chat of the 'bloids but love exactly what you're doing. And as well, if what you're doing hasn't changed at all, why should it matter to you that it doesn't take place in the same location as others? You're doing what you enjoy with the people you enjoyed doing it with either way, so what's the big problem there? You guys should be PROUD to have a new ongoing thread like this, to laud the fact your OCs have entered into forum culture in such a way. Maybe not everyone enjoys it like you, but so what? The forum is providing you guys with a way to express yourselves in that way and show your love for this. You can't lose.
A separate thread doesn't make you less than any one else or any other thread in the forum. Each for its own use for a purpose and reason, after all. This is just keeping with that concept--otherwise we might as well have the entirety of the forum in one single thread.
2. The Use of ICs in the 'Bloids
Some of you still seem to think you and your alternate personae have been entirely exiled from the 'bloids. That's not true. They can still come in with limited use, even have some limited dialogue with other posters. But it should be side related things that don't spin off into their own whole conversation. Having an OC pop up in a post will not get you yelled at, nor banned, nor nothing of the sort. If it gets to be too much, all that will be said (at most) is a request you move it to IC if it's going to be continued on. No trouble, no warnings, no bannings, nothing. And if someone DOES get snippy with you, just talk with a mod about it.
So to put this plainly: there isn't some line that you have to be afraid of crossing or stepping over. Stepping over "the line" may get you asked to move it over, but that'll be it. You're not going to get in trouble. And we can't give you a better description of where not to go, because it's another situation where there's no quantifiable description (x number posts, no more than so many words, etc). We're not that harsh, guys, that you have to be afraid of anything like that. There is no line. There's just a range of IC activity on the 'bloids that extends from none to too much. The closer you get to the "too much" side of the range, the more likely you'll be asked to move over to another thread. And that point may come at different times depending on who's there, and so forth. Just... don't overthink and worry about it.
Again, not to completely demean the OCs and IC-chatting, but if you really want something to base that on in interacting with the 'bloids, think about going to a room or social lounge with a bunch of friends. Treat the OCs in that context like you might treat bringing in a puppet or marionette or whatever you want to choose as a real-life version of the same concept. Think about how often you would bring them up or use them in a real life context like that, how much it might take before it started to get old for others and cross into "too much" territory. That might help you decide on where to draw the line a bit, if you're really wanting to have something to go off of.
3. The Lack of Mods Chatting Doesn't Mean They Don't See It
Mods read more things than you might think. Just because they aren't there chatting doesn't mean they don't see things that come up. True, it might be harder to keep up with a chat board that you don't participate in, and some things may fall through the cracks. If a problem comes up, just talk with a mod about it. That's always been the case for the bloids, too.
So between this and the points being made in the other post/announcement, we think everything is covered. Please consider these words and come to a point where you can move past any grudges or anger you may harbor about what happened. In the end, there were no hard feelings on our part towards you all, we were just trying to do our job on behalf of the forum and not what a small group of people wanted. It's rather saddening and disheartening to see that this still appears to be a problem for some people.
Thank you guys, and have a great day/night.
--NTWF Staff
