What would be considered intelligence?

[Bacon]

Wolf said:

N..o, actually. Knowledge is what you know. Intelligence is how you learn, and how you apply what you learn to what you do; smartness is how quickly you are able to grasp things. ^^

*gasp* Actually...you're right. Shows how smart\intelligent\knowing I am...................................

[theunorthodox]

It would eventually fail, though, wouldn't it? It'd just take longer. The core reactions would then be providing heat to places that had been getting it from the sun...right?

Well, if you put it that way, of course it will eventually fail when the planet goes kaput, just as the sun will eventually fail as will every star in the universe.

I don't see where you're getting with the rest of it. The core reactions would be providing heat to the places it had always been providing heat too: the places closest to it- like hydrothermal environments. The rest of the earth wouldn't be blasted to bits by AZ at once though. We still have an atmosphere. It would be pretty cold though. *shudders thinking about it*

[mushroom]

The said:

Well, if you put it that way, of course it will eventually fail when the planet goes kaput, just as the sun will eventually fail as will every star in the universe.

I don't see where you're getting with the rest of it. The core reactions would be providing heat to the places it had always been providing heat too: the places closest to it- like hydrothermal environments. The rest of the earth wouldn't be blasted to bits by AZ at once though. We still have an atmosphere. It would be pretty cold though. *shudders thinking about it*

Never mind, I guess. Thanks, though

[Jessica Coconut]

Firstly, I think that in the vastness of our universe, there is no way we can be alone. Why? We have no evidence disproving it, so why not? Always believe it could be until you can prove it can't. It's a matter of consideration. We as humans, are idiots. Honestly, we make so many mistakes, we rely on so many widgets and gadgets, and people almost never stop to consider consequences for stupid actions.

Really. We have wars. That should sum up that one in entirity. At least animals don't do battle, one species versus another, or one species in this location versus the same species somewhere else. It's one on one, you take down the idiot that started it. Humans are senseless - we bomb whole countries looking for one guy. (or a small group compared to the area being bombed)

I have faults. You have faults. We all have faults. And just like the faults in the earths lithosphere (I've just been studing for a big science exam), we all crack under them sometime. We end up doing something REALLY dumb.

There's no way we're alone out here - why should we, of all things, have the one planet that can support life. For all we know, maybe out there, somewhere, there's a kind of life that doesn't need any of the things we need to survive. Maybe they live on something other than water. Maybe they breathe noxious gases instead of air. There's no saying they can't.

Maybe WE can't, but we haven't even discovered all of the life on our own planet, let alone have the intelligence to say that life somewhere else can't exist. Just 'cause we can't live there, or anything on our planet, doesn't mean there can't be something else that can. For all we know, maybe instead of radiating heat, they live on cold. We've only touched the surface of space.

Now, back on topic. I believe they've decided the the question no longer is "How smart are you?" but "How are you smart?" As in, what topics are you smart in. How do you learn best? That's my 2 billion dollars.

[Bacon]

Coconut said:

Always believe it could be until you can prove it can't.

Okay, then I believe you killed 2,000,000 people in Tokyo, London, and Paris each last year.

[Bacon]

Coconut said:

(1)We as humans, are idiots. Honestly, we make so many mistakes, we rely on so many widgets and gadgets, and people almost never stop to consider consequences for stupid actions.

(2)Really. We have wars. That should sum up that one in entirity.

(3)I have faults. You have faults. We all have faults. We end up doing something REALLY dumb.

(4)There's no way we're alone out here - why should we, of all things, have the one planet that can support life?

(5)Maybe WE can't, but we haven't even discovered all of the life on our own planet, let alone have the intelligence to say that life somewhere else can't exist.

1:I agree that we do make stupid mistakes.

2:What's wrong wars? Really? The only time there will be no wars is in the time that THE DEVIL COMPLETELY TAKES OVER THE EARTH!

3:Just because we make mistakes doesn't make us dumb.

4:It may not be that no other planet supports life, it may just be there is none other.

5:I agree.

[mushroom]

Coconut said:

Firstly, I think that in the vastness of our universe, there is no way we can be alone. Why? We have no evidence disproving it, so why not? Always believe it could be until you can prove it can't. It's a matter of consideration.

Seduphe/Bacon's right. There's no disproof of the existence of leprechauns, but that doesn't make it reasonable to believe they exist. A lack of evidence for something isn't proof that it doesn't exist/isn't true, but it's usually silly to believe something that you don't have any evidence for.

I do think there's reason to believe life exists elsewhere, though. *shrugs* Other people have covered this already.

Coconut said:

Really. We have wars. That should sum up that one in entirity. At least animals don't do battle, one species versus another, or one species in this location versus the same species somewhere else. It's one on one, you take down the idiot that started it. Humans are senseless - we bomb whole countries looking for one guy. (or a small group compared to the area being bombed)

I'm pretty sure ants do, actually. Also, other animals fight--territory, mating.... Humans just happen to have the ability to organize, and the ability to make up reasons to fight.

[x2world]

KKM said:

Seduphe/Bacon's right. There's no disproof of the existence of leprechauns, but that doesn't make it reasonable to believe they exist. A lack of evidence for something isn't proof that it doesn't exist/isn't true, but it's usually silly to believe something that you don't have any evidence for.

I do think there's reason to believe life exists elsewhere, though. *shrugs* Other people have covered this already.

True, we cannot prove/disprove that there is/isn't any life elsewhere. I don't know wether I'm being naive in my next statement, but then again almost everything I say seems to be composed of absolute nonsense. In the criminal court system of the USA a person is innocent until proven guilty. The problem is is that it can be hard to decide who is innocent and who is guilty. For me I think this part of the discussion as the decision of which side is right at which side is wrong. Both sides believe that their side is the "innocent" side so both will stick with their beliefs until they feel that enough evidence has been given to prove that their side is guilty or innocent, correct or incorrect. Because of the vastness of space the field that we are to look in is staggeringly huge. Many use this fact as evidence in itself. However, because it is not concrete it is impossible as of yet to pose a verdict, the accused (the opposite theory from which the person is supporting) must go free. It is because of this both theories go free and continue to be prosocuted by the other. No one can decide who wrong.

Since I do not believe that there is any other life because that is what I have been taught and see no reason to believe otherwise I shall remain in such a state until this evidence which both sides sadly are lacking is produced. I can only hope that the truth is proven soon or else this quite argument will continue unsaid for perhaps a very long time.

I appologize for the rambling format that I have stated my thoughts. I hope that the concept came through undamaged.

[Jessica Coconut]

Seduphe/Bacon: said:

Okay, then I believe you killed 2,000,000 people in Tokyo, London, and Paris each last year.

Wow. You really know how to kill a statement... lemme see here.

OK, but where do you get this idea? You have nothing suggesting it beforehand. And before you say that neither does anything else, well, they have a lot of backlegend. People think they see a mermaids tail. People think they see alien spacecrafts. People look at photos and think they see what looks like an alien.

But honestly, you didn't even think you saw me kill those people. You're making a random statement to try to counteract what I said previously. Sarcastic comments can be quite weak when they're exaggerated - and weak in general.

You have no supporting evidence. But before you say that neither do aliens, well, it's because people think they actually see them sometimes, coupled with reported sightings of alien spacecrafts, and research showing that planets, say mars, may have had water once, and finding like, what may be bacteria. There's still something to suggest that idea.

Yeah, you could lie right here and say "but I did see you kill those people". But still. You're saying it for the purpose of killing my other argument, and that reason only, and that's where it falls short.

Does that make any sense?

Boy, do I feel overwhelmed.

With regards to faults not making us dumb, I mean, when we actually do do something INCREDIBLY GASTRONOMICALLY dumb, affecting the whole world, then, you might consider that person being dumb. But seriously, can you really say humans are smart? Over all of the incredibly senseless, inconsiderate things we do, can you really truly say that we are smart? You know what I'm talking about. Yeah, we know math and science, and have developed a pretty decent communication system, that makes us knowledgeable. But are we really "wise"?

I didn't say animals didn't fight. I know they fight. But they don't pit species against species, trying to eradicate eachother. Give me an actual example where 2 species decided that they would try to eliminate the other on purpose, and I'll shut up. Maybe certain animals have made others go extinct, but not on purpose. It would be for food or something, and they accidentally wiped all of them out. Humans do try to eradicate people of other ethnicities, religions, colours - it's called genocide.

To KKM: Seriously? Ants try to kill other species of ants? LIke, WHOLE SPECIES? Can you give me a reference to that perhaps? If it's true, I'd like to hear about it - it'd make an interesting topic to teach in science class. Sometime, we get a turn to teach the class something science related, if you're wondering what I meant.

[mushroom]

Coconut said:

With regards to faults not making us dumb, I mean, when we actually do do something INCREDIBLY GASTRONOMICALLY dumb, affecting the whole world, then, you might consider that person being dumb. But seriously, can you really say humans are smart? Over all of the incredibly senseless, inconsiderate things we do, can you really truly say that we are smart? You know what I'm talking about. Yeah, we know math and science, and have developed a pretty decent communication system, that makes us knowledgeable. But are we really "wise"?

I didn't say animals didn't fight. I know they fight. But they don't pit species against species, trying to eradicate eachother. Give me an actual example where 2 species decided that they would try to eliminate the other on purpose, and I'll shut up. Maybe certain animals have made others go extinct, but not on purpose. It would be for food or something, and they accidentally wiped all of them out. Humans do try to eradicate people of other ethnicities, religions, colours - it's called genocide.

To KKM: Seriously? Ants try to kill other species of ants? LIke, WHOLE SPECIES? Can you give me a reference to that perhaps? If it's true, I'd like to hear about it - it'd make an interesting topic to teach in science class. Sometime, we get a turn to teach the class something science related, if you're wondering what I meant.

I may have misworded that. Ants war by colony, not by species--with some exceptions; sometimes colonies of a species will be neutral towards each other, or even cooperate. Also, some kinds of ants raise slaves from pupae carried off from the nests of other species. (This isn't quite like slavery among humans--the "slaves" are of a different species than the slaveowners, and the different species of ants are spread over a family. It's something like domestication, if humans domesticated apes or the other way around.*)

The entry about ants on wikipedia.com mentions slaveowning ants; the FAQ at antcolony.org mentions fighting between colonies (and cooperation between colonies) under the "Habits" section. You'll have to do your own research on this one, unfortunately; I'm not coming up with much on ant behavior for laypeople online. Try the nonfiction section at a local library.

Don't forget, either, that lions commit infanticide; when a new male or group of males takes over a pride, it may kill the pride's cubs. As the groups of males are based on kinship (and so are killing the cubs of unrelated males), this is something like genocide.

So, animals really aren't as innocent as you seem to think they are.

Also, there's a distinction between intelligence and wisdom. If someone says humans are intelligent, you're wasting your time arguing that humans aren't wise. You may have a valid point, but the two of you probably aren't discussing the same thing.

And, finally, intelligent people are certainly able to do dumb things, particularly given misinformation.

*Old science fiction movies. Yay.

[faeriedust]

[There's no way we're alone out here - why should we, of all things, have the one planet that can support life. For all we know, maybe out there, somewhere, there's a kind of life that doesn't need any of the things we need to survive. Maybe they live on something other than water. Maybe they breathe noxious gases instead of air. There's no saying they can't.

Maybe WE can't, but we haven't even discovered all of the life on our own planet, let alone have the intelligence to say that life somewhere else can't exist. Just 'cause we can't live there, or anything on our planet, doesn't mean there can't be something else that can. For all we know, maybe instead of radiating heat, they live on cold. We've only touched the surface of space.

I totally agree.

Take Mars. There may not be life there now, but millions of years ago the was liquid water. That means there could have been a life form on Mars similar to that of Earth in at least one way: one that needed water to survive.

Next there's Europa, one of Jupiter's moons. If I remember correctly, Europa's surface is a cracked crust of ice that's miles thick. But under this, is a sort of ocean, and under that a rocky core. This core is just warm enough to make the ocean stay just that - an ocean of liquid water. So isn't it also possible for there to be forms of life on Europa?

And that would only be for life that would need water, but what if there's one that doesn't?

If life could exist on those planets, even billions of years ago if not today, isn't it extremely likely that it exists on other places, given the immense size of the universe? If life doesn't and hasn't existed on Mars or Europa, it might mean that it's a rare thing, but that does not make it impossible.

Human inventions have detected dozens of other planets revolving around a star, much like our own Solar System. They just haven't discovered whether or not they have life forms yet. But, there's alway the chance that they do.

I'm done now. Yes, I know, this post is very iffy. I'll come back tomorrow to see if anyone decided to answer.

[Bacon]

Coconut said:

(1)Wow. You really know how to kill a statement...

(2)You have no supporting evidence. But before you say that neither do aliens, well, it's because people think they actually see them sometimes, coupled with reported sightings of alien spacecrafts, and research showing that planets, say mars, may have had water once, and finding like, what may be bacteria. There's still something to suggest that idea.

(3)Yeah, you could lie right here and say "but I did see you kill those people". But still. You're saying it for the purpose of killing my other argument, and that reason only, and that's where it falls short.

(4)You know what I'm talking about. Yeah, we know math and science, and have developed a pretty decent communication system, that makes us knowledgeable. But are we really "wise"?

1 Why thank you.

2I never said there wasn't upporting evidence, I just said that the evidence doesn't mean it's true. Okay, so my example was stupid, but what if there's somebody saying you robbed the bank, and they have evidence? Then they show video footage of what looks like you robbing it, and two or three witnesses say they saw you do it. Does that mean you did it? No, it means somebody that looks like you did it. Maybe it was a lost twin, or some other relative, or maybe a complete stranger that looks like you. Understand?

3I never lie anyways.

4No, humans as a whole are not "wise", but some humans are wise. Not as if they have all the knowledge possible, just they know how to live a good life, what to do when, so on and doing it. Knowing you though, you probably want names. Sorry, I can't help you there.

[Bacon]

TE said:

I totally agree.

Take Mars. There may not be life there now, but millions of years ago the was liquid water.

What makes you think that?Because somebody told you, what makes them think that? Or maybe you did research, how do you know it was accurate? Nothing is certain, even and especially Carbon Dating.

[Jessica Coconut]

Seduphe/Bacon:Alpha's said:

1 Why thank you.

2I never said there wasn't upporting evidence, I just said that the evidence doesn't mean it's true. Okay, so my example was stupid, but what if there's somebody saying you robbed the bank, and they have evidence? Then they show video footage of what looks like you robbing it, and two or three witnesses say they saw you do it. Does that mean you did it? No, it means somebody that looks like you did it. Maybe it was a lost twin, or some other relative, or maybe a complete stranger that looks like you. Understand?

3I never lie anyways.

4No, humans as a whole are not "wise", but some humans are wise. Not as if they have all the knowledge possible, just they know how to live a good life, what to do when, so on and doing it. Knowing you though, you probably want names. Sorry, I can't help you there.

4. Knowing me? Names? No, I don't want names in fact. I know a lot of wise people. But I'm talking about humanity as a whole. But humanity as a whole is a rash, harsh, idiotic society. I could give you all examples, but I'm sure you know if you've heard of George Bush. Before you say he's only one man, he's supposed to represent the world superpower. Yes, while technically he only represents 50 something percent of it, still. According to Americans, he's the man that best represents the whole country.

I don't really have much to comment on your other statements. They don't need commenting, and there's nothing for me to argue.

[faeriedust]

Seduphe/Bacon:Save said:

What makes you think that?Because somebody told you, what makes them think that? Or maybe you did research, how do you know it was accurate? Nothing is certain, even and especially Carbon Dating.

Yes, I did infact do research. All my space books, movies, and loads of sites in the Internet say that Mars once had liquid water.