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Post by Deleted on May 11, 2012 14:55:41 GMT -5
I now officially LOATHE Australian airports. To treat animals like...luggage. Ugh. It would be the same thing as detaining someone's child in my eyes.
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Post by Stal on May 11, 2012 15:29:42 GMT -5
Almost all countries are that way for traveling pets. Customs needs to clear the animal and usually detains it for testing and the like. In pretty much any country you travel to.
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Post by Nimras on May 11, 2012 16:08:09 GMT -5
(Just waiting for Nim to turn it upside down. ) And there is really no reason for them not to let potential owners view the animals. Anyone looking to buy/adopt a puppy should definitely check them out first, and possibly view the parents if they're home-bred. It's the responsible thing to do. And they require a hefty deposit to do so? It's almost transparent. WHY do things like this get posted when I'm in no condition to post a nice textwall where I EXPLAIN ALL THE THINGS!?! I'd do a fist flail, but I'd fall out of the couch. And that would probably still hurt, despite the number of meds in my system right now. (HOORAY PNEUMONIA!) VERY SHORT VERSION where I can hopefully not ramble off into too many directions... (Oh! I found a picture of a fuzzy butterfly...thing! Ohhh!) *cough* Deliberately breeding for "teacup" "pixie" "imperial" or other ODDLY TINY versions of the breed has serious health issues for the puppies. I've had students who had lifelong heart conditions, needed severe invasive surgery as puppies (and onto adulthood), and other complications. I've had two puppies in my classes die as a result of being bred to be teacups; one because it's digestive system couldn't digest food, and the other had holes in his heart and he died on the surgery table when they were trying to fix it because his heart couldn't supply blood to his whole body. The practice is truly horrific. As for letting people come visit the puppies when they're young, it's not actually a good idea when they're super young (younger than 5 weeks) because their immune systems are pretty much non-existant at that point. Anyone who handles the puppies should be in clean clothes that haven't had contact with other dogs than the ones the puppies have already been exposed to, and have sterilized their hands. Most people I know who have puppies at this age set up a webcam for the future homes of the puppies to watch them without endangering the puppies. Once they've had their first round of shots at 5 1/2-6 weeks, people can come visit them as long as they've not been around any sick dogs, and can handle them after just washing their hands. Once they've had their second set (this is usually at 8-9 weeks) they can start interacting with friends other dogs that are healthy and up to date on their shots. They shouldn't meet dogs who haven't been immunized until they're at least 6 months old, because that's when they've got a more robust immune system. Sooooo.... If they're breeding "teacup" puppies, they're going to have delicate health, and thus people coming to visit are actually a risk to the puppies health. So they're right to not want people coming to visit. But they're wrong to breed the puppies in the first place. EDIT: BECAUSE I AM ON DRUGS AND I CAN NOT SHUT UP ... A friend of mine tried to take their family dog into Australia - it was a labrador and it had worked for the police - and border security detained it in customs for a week. The family kept visiting the dog and bringing it bones and things to eat and chew. And it died in customs. ... I'm going to have to ask for more detail on this one. Animals dying in customs is quite rare. Rare enough that I have to ask if the dog's name was Sydney. And bones and chews actually kill a lot of dogs, especially dogs that might be chewing on them differently than normal due to a change in surroundings. I'd want to hear the results of the postmortem (if a dog dies in Australian custody, it's the law for a postmortem to be done).
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Post by Pacmanite on May 11, 2012 18:47:37 GMT -5
I now officially LOATHE Australian airports. To treat animals like...luggage. Ugh. It would be the same thing as detaining someone's child in my eyes. While I definitely don't like what happened to the dog, I don't think the concept of keeping an animal in quarantine is the same as treating them like luggage. Sometimes humans get kept in the quarantine zone for a certain number of days, if the immigrations officers suspect that they may be carrying an epidemic disease (depending on where they came from, and if there's been an outbreak where they were at). The intent of animal quarantine is to limit the spread of pests and diseases into Australia, since new pests and diseases can pose a serious threat to Australian wildlife and agriculture. ... A friend of mine tried to take their family dog into Australia - it was a labrador and it had worked for the police - and border security detained it in customs for a week. The family kept visiting the dog and bringing it bones and things to eat and chew. And it died in customs. ... I'm going to have to ask for more detail on this one. Animals dying in customs is quite rare. Rare enough that I have to ask if the dog's name was Sydney. And bones and chews actually kill a lot of dogs, especially dogs that might be chewing on them differently than normal due to a change in surroundings. I'd want to hear the results of the postmortem (if a dog dies in Australian custody, it's the law for a postmortem to be done). I wish I could give you more details, actually, but I haven't spoken to this friend in about three years. We went to school together and she was in the year level below. Her family immigrated to Australia from Hong Kong, taking their police dog with them (the father was a police officer). They probably arrived in Melbourne airport, but I'm not a hundred percent sure. My friend would have been rather young at the time, but she remembered that the dinners for the whole week were steaks with T-bones in them because they wanted to give the bones to the dog. I can guess that the family hadn't been in the habit of eating T-bone steaks (it's not the sort of meal Chinese families would normally make), and if the steaks were all new to the family, the dog possibly wasn't used to eating bones either. But that's a theory. The only other detail I have is that the family didn't get to keep the dog's body afterwards, because it was a police dog, and for some reason the bodies of police dogs get donated to science. At least, that's what my friend told me. I can't remember if she said anything about postmortem results. (And I can't remember what the dog was called.) ... Australia is pretty notorious for having strict quarantine laws (and being isolated and far away from everywhere). Someone would be nuts to buy a new puppy from an overseas website like the teacup puppies site and have it sent all the way over.
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Post by Huntress on May 11, 2012 20:22:52 GMT -5
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't feeding bones to dogs considered bad practice anyway? Bones give shards. Shards are not fun things to get lodged in your tongue and throat, especially if you eat like, well, a dog (a practice also known as OMG FOOD NOM NOM CHOW CHOMP CHOMP CHOMP.)
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Post by Nimras on May 11, 2012 20:37:32 GMT -5
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't feeding bones to dogs considered bad practice anyway? Bones give shards. Shards are not fun things to get lodged in your tongue and throat, especially if you eat like, well, a dog (a practice also known as OMG FOOD NOM NOM CHOW CHOMP CHOMP CHOMP.) Yeah, leftover food bones (especially thin bones like T-Bones) kill thousands of dogs a year in the US alone. They're incredibly dangerous. I'd almost bet money that's what killed the dog. Which is doubly horrible, because they probably gave them to the dog because they felt guilty for him or her being in quarantine. Most animal quarantine facilities are actually pretty nice, because it's often someone's first contact with the country, so it's considered a "first impression" that gets high priority for care. That's why it's the law in Australia for an autopsy if any animal dies in their care, because the Australian government itself is liable for the animals care. Which is why I'm also somewhat dubious that someone could send a puppy under 10 weeks to Australia legally, because it would be a huge liability Google informs me that it is illegal to ship a puppy to Australia that is under 4 months of age (16 weeks).
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Post by Pacmanite on May 12, 2012 5:56:17 GMT -5
This has been informative. I wouldn't have guessed that bones were bad for dogs otherwise. And yeah, it does sound pretty tragic what happened to the family dog, especially given the amount of effort the family went through to get those bones to the dog - eating food they're not used to cooking, driving out all the way to the airport several times to visit and bring those bones... unfortunate dog. And it's comforting to know that it's illegal to transport young puppies into Australia. I suppose that could mean that the teacup puppies website was lying when it said that one of their puppies was sold to a girl in Australia (look under "Baby Snow White"). Or that the puppy was older than 16 weeks when she was sent over. Or that they tried to send her over illegally and managed not to get prosecuted for it, though if that were the case they probably wouldn't be so proud to declare it on their website.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2012 10:01:10 GMT -5
I saw those pics and they look almost like little stuffed animals...poor things are so tiny that someone could step on them! D'=
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Post by Dju on May 14, 2012 16:23:52 GMT -5
I now officially LOATHE Australian airports. To treat animals like...luggage. Ugh. It would be the same thing as detaining someones child in my eyes. Even though the treatment airports give to pets has a bad reputation (with good reason, I heard many cases of pets that died of starvation during quarantine) we can't deny that they do have a point... Many diseases spread through dogs and cats in countries that aren't prepared to deal with them. Not to mention introducing an animal to a different habitat can cause serious consequences, I heard Dodos were extinct because cats, dogs and pigs were brought to Australia!
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2012 16:33:26 GMT -5
I now officially LOATHE Australian airports. To treat animals like...luggage. Ugh. It would be the same thing as detaining someones child in my eyes. Even though the treatment airports give to pets has a bad reputation (with good reason, I heard many cases of pets that died of starvation during quarantine) we can't deny that they do have a point... Many diseases spread through dogs and cats in countries that aren't prepared to deal with them. Not to mention introducing an animal to a different habitat can cause serious consequences, I heard Dodos were extinct because cats, dogs and pigs were brought to Australia! What if your cat is perfectly healthy?
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Post by Celestial on May 14, 2012 16:53:32 GMT -5
Minor correction: Dodos were found on Mauritius, not Australia. But the principle is still the same. If you have an ecosystem which has been perfectly balanced for millenia, the last thing you want to do is to introduce something new and potentially deadly. Even though the treatment airports give to pets has a bad reputation (with good reason, I heard many cases of pets that died of starvation during quarantine) we can't deny that they do have a point... Many diseases spread through dogs and cats in countries that aren't prepared to deal with them. Not to mention introducing an animal to a different habitat can cause serious consequences, I heard Dodos were extinct because cats, dogs and pigs were brought to Australia! What if your cat is perfectly healthy? They can't know that. And your cat could have easily picked up something on the plane or at the airport which may take a while to manifest symptoms. They have to take all the precautions that they can in order to safeguard the already devastated ecosystem. However, quarantine measures are a separate topic from this which is better suited to another thread. You're welcome to create one however. I would love to see how this debate progresses.
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Post by Ginz ❤ on May 14, 2012 17:04:27 GMT -5
Even though the treatment airports give to pets has a bad reputation (with good reason, I heard many cases of pets that died of starvation during quarantine) we can't deny that they do have a point... Many diseases spread through dogs and cats in countries that aren't prepared to deal with them. Not to mention introducing an animal to a different habitat can cause serious consequences, I heard Dodos were extinct because cats, dogs and pigs were brought to Australia! What if your cat is perfectly healthy? Then they'll probably let you take your cat home as soon as they make sure it is perfectly healthy. But they can't take any chances. * But anyway, about the teacup puppies, it's too bad that these breeders take advantage of people who don't know better. =/ I wasn't familiar with the 'teacups', so I personally didn't know this kind of thing had so many awful consequences for the puppies. I guess spreading the word about it is a great first step. I mean, if no one was willing to buy the puppies, they would stop breeding them in such harmful ways. It's so sad that they do. =(
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Post by Gav on May 15, 2012 0:08:34 GMT -5
I'd just like to point out that Australia has a very very good reason for being so strict on quarantine- they're the last place with wild marsupials (kangaroos, koalas, etc.) and many other animals and plants, and that's not only really important for global animal studies, but being a big tourism draw.
Also, they've had issues with introduced animals in the past- escaped rabbits into the Australian countryside bred like... well, rabbits and devastated the ecosystem. If I'm not wrong, rabbits are recognized as a pest there.
But all this is a different debate, so I'll leave it at that.
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Post by Komori on May 15, 2012 10:33:31 GMT -5
Opossums are marsupials, and there are plenty of them wild in North America.
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