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Post by Schefflera on Nov 8, 2006 19:44:48 GMT -5
Sorry about that; I thought perhaps I had been too belligerent, and I edited my post while you were replying to it. In case anyone is confused, I asked if she would appreciate the same behavior from stray dogs (which had been emphasized in her earlier post, and which I do realize are a real problem in some areas) as we were getting from cats. She took this in better spirit than it probably deserved. I also realize that appropriate behavior and restraint for pets depends to some degree on where you live. My in-laws live in a more rural area where leash laws are either nonexistent or not enforced, and both cats and dogs roam freely across various yards, and can go farther without crossing a road, although they've had a few hit by cars anyway. They usually come home at the end of the day to whoever will give them free food, as far as I can tell. (No word yet on how the recently acquired goat is getting along. I should ask.) I can't say I'd want to move there, but it is pretty even-handed and perhaps some of the animals are happier that way. Certainly I imagine any of them would have trouble adjusting if they suddenly had to be fenced, leashed, or kept indoors! In my parents' neighborhood, there are leash laws for dogs. And there are good reasons to have them there, yes. We kept ours inside a fence when we weren't walking her, but if she had slipped out the gate (which she sometimes did) or learned to jump it (which she did not), and caused damage while she was out, we would have been responsible, both morally and legally. But it was somewhat frustrating that the cats could apparently do pretty much whatever they wanted with impunity. I'm pretty sure my parents tried talking to the owners a few times, when they could find an owner (some of the cats probably are real strays, and a cat who's been misbehaving in someone else's yard doesn't usually seem to want to come have its collar checked for an address ) but it didn't seem to accomplish much. I should probably apologize. I knew that the subject of cats on the loose was a frustrating one for me, for reasons unrelated to the safety of the cats themselves, and I had intended to stay out of the discussion.
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Post by Huntress on Nov 9, 2006 15:04:02 GMT -5
Right, totally forgot about the other creatures' point of view x.x; True, birds and rabbits and other small prey suffer just as much from cats as cats suffer from cars and cruel people and everything like that.
Remember The Little Prince by Saint-Exupery? "Once you've tamed someone, you're responsible for them." Meaning that you need to make sure that the one you've tamed is both safe and not a threat to others.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2006 17:11:57 GMT -5
I live near a methadone clinic. Cats stay inside for fear of (hungry) junkies.
They're perfectly happy.
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Post by Aizar on Nov 29, 2006 20:18:58 GMT -5
Hmm.... Our cat is an indoors-er, because if she got outside, the coyotes would kill and eat her. She goes "wild" from time to time, running about the house with her tail puffed up and her ruff up--I have speculation as to if she is scared of something (but this would mean she is scared a lot of the time) or if she is just bored. Or maybe it's a mixture of both. I think in general that animals ( and pets) should have as much freedom as possible. Being a pet, even with all the freedoms we humans can give them and still call them "ours" does not remotely compare to the freedoms of living wild and roaming the vast expanses of the wild. Stay at home for just one day in your room or in your home and do only the things your cat or dog is allowed to do. How bored do you get? But the outdoors for a cat can be dangerous, especially if you have bears or coyotes or foxes living just next door (like we do). Even other outdoor cats can pose a problem (and pregnancy). There are also cars to think about, and if your cat doesn't have a collar, he or she might get stolen and if he/she got lost you would have a harder time finding him/her (although now with microchips, that's not as much of a problem). So after that explanation...I think I would keep my cat outdoors if I thought it safe for her. If we were out in the country without too much hungry wildlife. And I would not declaw her, even her front claws! That is her main protection. In a neighborhood, I would be more cautious and have to think about it carefully...I'd at least neuter/spay her (him?). And in this neighborhood, with hungry wildlife+a busy street right next to us, she stays inside. But she has the run of the house. (And still has all her claws, in case she does get outside. Keeps that pesky dog cowed too )
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Post by Sock on Dec 2, 2006 1:54:15 GMT -5
Well, I have an outdoor cat myself, but for a number of reasons. He is a very adventurous cat and would prefer to be outside, considering he was a stray we took in, my parents are allergic, I have little space and my rats certainly wouldn't be happy. But it depends on where oyu live, much like Kiddo said. I live in a small town and I, especially, live in a small area. There are houses around, but cars rarely travel by, and if it does, it's slowly. It's a dirt road and all our neighbors like cats, and treat him with respect. Other animals hardly ever come into the scene, and if they are, they're never anything that could potentially harm a cat. I also keep my cat in my garage at night, or when it rains, or when he "asks" (meows) to go in. (which may sound bad, but it's warm in there, and there are several things he can lay in and such, to make him feel comfortable. If he didn't want to go in there he would certainly tell me, ha). He is perfectly happy. I would love to have him inside, but I just can't, and I think he honestly enjoys it more inside.
I think that, if you were to keep an outside cat without any shelter outside all the time, by a bustling road and many large dogs or other creatures that could potentially harm your cat, then yes, that would be bad. And it also depends on the cat. If the cat was raised as a house cat all it's life, then it would be a house cat and not know how to survive outside. But if your cat had been an outside cat nearly all it's life or all of it's life, then it would enjoy being outside. But, cats who live inside should be let outside for fresh air, just like dogs should. Every animal who can be let outside and benefits from being outside, should be let outside, if you have the proper things to take it outside. So really, some outside cats are in poor conditions and some are not, just as some inside cats are in poor condition and some are not. It all comes down to the cat itself.
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Post by troublems03 on Dec 2, 2006 2:38:38 GMT -5
My cat is an outside cat. Simply because she was raised that way since we got her as a kitten. I don't really remember to back then, as it was some 14 years ago and I'm 16 now some I don't know why we made that choice. But my point is that if you have a cat that's kept outdoors there should be some sort of responsibility on the owner to make sure that they are not killing the wildlife, etc.
This is an issue where I live as there are lots of native birds and some other native animals such as possums (and snakes). If we let Sandy outside then there is the possibility that she'll kill the wildlife, but it only seems to have happened when no-one has fed her or some other cat of the area has eaten her food. On the contrary, if she is kept inside she will most certainly go crazy. She likes being inside when it is wet or really hot but otherwise she just seems caged inside. In that way I think cats should be allowed outdoors but allowing them to being outside cats brings with it the responsability of making sure that they don't destroy the wildlife.
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Post by Warlock on Dec 2, 2006 2:41:42 GMT -5
Personally I say yes a thousand times over!
Cats are natural hunters, no matter how much you feed them or love them, they will always hunt and kill for fun.
Ive called Animal Control several times on the bloody cats next door, their owner always lets them out at night even though our house backs onto a nature reserve! You can hear them screeching at all hours of the night, and there are always feathers or fur left near their house.
Sometimes I dont think its so much the cats fault, it cant help being what it is, but owners need to take responsibility
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Post by zipperaward on Dec 2, 2006 7:52:20 GMT -5
My cat comes from africa, at some point he was stray. Lets just say he is a wild thing....
But I am now in the united states, and I have watched my cat cause trouble (he gets into my neighbors house, and he seems to gain weight from that)
Not only that, he got into a lot of cat fights. In one, they had to stick a tube in him to drain all of his fluids out so he would not get an infection. The other time, he was clawed in the face, and the infection would not go away for months. He baisically had a hole in his face.
He is no longer allowed outside, for he seems to like fighting other cats, AND he gains weight from eating at the neighbors house.
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Post by flufey on Dec 6, 2006 18:00:32 GMT -5
We've had four cats. One always got in fights till he froze to death (advice: keep your cat inside on freezing nights XD). One little kitten was the most brainless thing in the world, he got hit by a car T_T
The other two are smarter and they're allowed both inside and out. They've successfully survived five years! ^^
I live in a relatively quiet neighborhood (car-wise, not people-wise, heh) so just do what you think is best for your cat I'd suggest.
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Post by Pacmanite on Dec 13, 2006 22:40:51 GMT -5
I heard that in (at least some parts of) Australia, there are laws forbidding people to let their cats out at night. This isn't just for the cat's sake, it's for all the native animals that they hunt. My neighbours have a cat, which thankfully I've only seen preying on feral pigeons and blackbirds (and leaving the carcasses in my garden). He constantly wears a collar with bells, but it doesn't seem to have hindered him much.
I don't think cats should be let outside, at least not without supervision. They are natural hunters, we've seen in the past how capable they are of wiping out species, and bells aren't foolproof. Besides, the law about them not being let out at night doesn't necessarily work because cats are active hunters during the day as well. As said before, it's not the cat's fault that they have the instincts, so the owners should be more responsible.
As for the thing about cats being cooped up inside... I used to watch a pet show called "Harry's Practice", and it always advised that you bring up your cat to be an indoor one, so it would be comfortable with that sort of lifestyle. I understand that if your cat was once a stray, there isn't much you can do, but if you're thinking of "greatest good for greatest number", does one otherwise-miserable cat justify the multitude of birds, possums, quolls etc. that a cat can kill in its lifetime?
But again, it's about what area you live in. If you're in a rural area next to a National Park or something similar, I don't think it's a good idea to let your cat loose. If you're in a place with much lower risk of a cat coming across a native animal, or if you're in the cat's ancestor's natural habitat where they're actually part of the ecosystem, then it wouldn't be so bad.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2006 11:09:15 GMT -5
When I get a cat, I'll keep it indoors.
Why?
Cause... I don't want it to be infested with fleas and other stuff like that, I don't want to risk it getting run over by a car or mauled by another animal, I'd like to have a calm and family friendly cat - I think letting it outside only makes it more wild.
BUT! I also believe that to have a cat indoors, you must have room enough for it. Not just a small space where it can walk from one side of the room to the other in 20 steps. They are still animals, and even the smallest of pets needs a good amount of space around them.
Think about -why- you want a cat in the first place.
Only exception, is when you live on a farm. Having a cat outside can help you with pestproblems like rats, etc.
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Post by ohmandoh on Dec 15, 2006 19:11:55 GMT -5
Cats can be perfectly happy in a small apartment. The key is companionship. If the cat spends large amount of times there alone, it will need to have a friend. Alot of people assume that because a cat, no matter how long it has been an indoor cat, still tries to bolt out the door that it desires freedom. That not true. What it's really doing is playing with you. It may only go a few steps out the door then it will look at you as if saying, 'haha, I got out '. Another big problem with outdoor cats is the spread of feline diseases. There are plenty out there that you can't protect against. Like the feline flu. There is a notion here that being wild is some kind of beautiful thing that a cat deserves. This is just wrong. Wild cats spend most of their time trying protect their territory and fend off starvation. They are ruled by their hormones and this can be very stressful for a cat. Believe me, the cat is not having fun out there. It is surviving. Now when you tame a cat, provide it with daily meals, love and attention, but still allow it to roam free, it's still going to have some of that instinct to protect it's food source and reproduce (if not fixed). It's genetics. Raise a cat indoors and you'll never have that problem. If you run into a stray cat... do a favor and get it fixed. If you're going to provide it with food, though, bring him indoors. That should be a requirement. If the cat is going insane to get out, let him out, but don't feed him anymore. Try not to get attached to stray cats. You'll be doing no favors by feeding them. Fed stray cats reproduce and cause larger problems. You feed him, you're responsible for that cat and all descendants thereafter. Try to keep that in mind when your heart strings get pulled.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 17, 2006 0:06:08 GMT -5
My cats like the indoors and our lanai. I think it's much safer for them inside but some cats are just... outdoors-y. I'll keep it short and sweet: It's much better for cats to be indoor so I'll say yes to the main question.
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